it's an iconic place for the civil rights struggle and the children's crusade in 1963. but what is he able to do in birmingham in a way that challenges what we think about this. >> he did not want to be a farmer. he did not want to be a sharecropper. this is a place that early on was that segregated. we think about her manhattan is misrepresented -- but the office, when he first appears in the census as a homeowner has white neighbors end up with that, not the time. it was a place where someone who wanted to make his mark at at the field could do that. >> so he buys property? >> he buys property. >> another property owner. >> between you and me again -- >> s., make and found office. >> he really is an amazing carrier chair and he becomes for you one of the most distant relatives who has this amazing story. but you also find people you interview the new doll face and also new melvina. so tell us how you were able to write about melvina life. >> one of the amazing things has been able to find people who actually knew melvina can a woman born into slavery in 1844. i found